• Lawsuit Claims FCA Sold Ram Cummins Trucks with Defect: Lower MPG, Costly Repairs, and Illegal Emissions


    2014 ram 3500 cummins engine fca emissions
    2014 Ram 3500 HD – 6.7L Cummins I6

    A class action lawsuit claims that Fiat Chrysler Automobiles (FCA) knowingly sold Ram Cummins HD pickup trucks with defective diesel emissions treatment equipment. The lawsuit identifies at least 135,000 heavy duty trucks (model year 2014-2016) equipped with a 6.7L Cummins I6 engine.

    The allegation points to an existing litigation between FCA US LLC and Cummins Inc that has to do with defective Selective Catalytic Reduction (SCR) and Diesel Particulate Filter (DPF) systems and resulting recalls for fixes. The claim brings several consumer complaints. Complaints state that FCA/Ram dealerships performed several software updates that direct more fuel into the exhaust system to clean the DPF during the “regen” cycle. These updates are claimed to significantly lower the MPG (by around 20-25%), cause excessive exhaust system temperatures that can damage the system and lead to costly repairs, and also cause excessive exhaust emissions at illegal levels.

    See full FCA Ram Cummins lawsuit document.

    TFLtruck has not experienced the issues alleged in this lawsuit: “limp” mode, decreased performance, dramatically lower fuel economy. TFLtruck is currently unable to test real-world oxides of nitrogen (NOx) emissions, due to high cost of testing equipment. TFLtruck is unable to confirm the NOx emission levels.

    Learn more about the Diesel Exhaust Fluid (DEF) system here.

    Here is our latest HD truck efficiency testing. The 2017 Ram 3500 HD got the best MPG result on our highway loop when compared directly against Chevy Duramax and Ford Power Stroke with a 22,800 lbs trailer.


    Andre Smirnov
    Andre Smirnov
    Andre Smirnov is an Automotive Enthusiast, Producer, Reviewer, Videographer, Writer, Software Engineer, Husband, Father, and Friend.

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    71 thoughts on “Lawsuit Claims FCA Sold Ram Cummins Trucks with Defect: Lower MPG, Costly Repairs, and Illegal Emissions

    1. Ok, I did not read all of the attached article but it looks like the ram guys are mad
      Because there was an emissions recall on all their trucks and now they have reduced fuel economy. I can understand their issue but fuel economy is not rated on these trucks so they are out of luck. If the exhaust system is a Cummins system, I doubt the regent will damage the exhaust system. They just want their economy back so they came up with this lawsuit. But the real question is, and i mentioned this, was the dually sent by ram a special programmed ram maybe not updated with the latest emissions software in it?????

      1. Hi I disagree with “the regen will not damage the exhaust.” I had to have my DPF catch, filter and sensor replaced due to tiger striping caused by over heating of the system. I had to pay 5k because it was not covered under my factory warrenty. (Truck had 50k at the time.) The reprograming at 20K took me from 18mpg avg to 9 mpg avg. I was very disapointed and mad that I had to pay for the repair that should of bin under my warrenty.( chrysler factory extended warrenty 4 years unlimited milage.)

        1. Under normal conditions the DPF will not get damaged from regens. A defective filter can though. If for some reason the system is way over fueling and bringing temps past the normal threshold then it can fail. However one of the EGT’s should catch it prior to failing. However without seeing the actual damage it is hard to say why your system failed but word of mouth indicates your not alone in FCA warranty denial claims.

    2. I will have to read more of that document when I get time but them claiming more DPF regens don’t make sense. The DPF is a filter. It will require a regen when needed. No matter what. So I suspect they are adding more EGR to meet emissions and thus the extra fuel. And that will add to more regens because of the extra fuel.

    3. Waaa waaa waaa….

      Sharks smelling blood in the water. They are suing FCA for being too slow to win their lawsuit against Cummins. Grow up people. Sometimes a vehicle design sucks. You aren’t entitled to a perfect vehicle… if you end up with a crappy one you tell everyone who will listen how bad it was.

      1. Uhmmm yes I am… if I’m paying upwards of 60K for a vehicle, I expect it to work as advertised. We also are elated when we buy a truck that works fantastic, and tout it just as much.

    4. Is this the same group of lawyers that brought the lawsuit against GM? Seems they are throwing what they can to see what sticks, or if they can get the manufacturer to settle out of court… Really sad. I’ll have to look for more collaborating evidence before I think this is a well founded case.

    5. The Gov wants us all to buy electric cars, so they hit at Diesel vehicles every chance they get.
      The claim is that they are trying to preserve the ecosystem to which I say “Balderdash”. If they really wanted to clean up the air for everyone they would go after the people who are really polluting. When you see someone “blowing coal” they are polluting far worse than 100 diesels that are performing as designed. The blacker the exhaust, the worse they are polluting. Does the government do anything about this? Only in Colorado, and then the fine is peanuts for scofflaws who pollute on purpose.
      If they were really concerned about cleaning up the atmosphere, the EPA would hit first offenders with a $5000 fine, and second offenders would lose their truck AND pay an additional $5000. I guarantee this would clean up the air more than fining automakers because their engines put out half of a percent more Nitrous Oxide.
      Maybe the solution is to bottle up the NOX and sell it to Hot Rodders.
      BTW, if Nitros Dioxide is even worse, why do we allow people to use NOX to increase their torque/BHP as they are converting it to NDO? Are plants around dragstrips having problems dealing with the air?

      1. While I agree the Gov is trying to force electric vehicles upon the People, don’t think that rolling coal means the vehicle is necessarily polluting more. Black smoke means you are seeing a lot of visible particulate matter (PM) which are larger chunks are partially burned diesel / carbon. It signifies the engine is being overfueled. While you wouldn’t want to breathe in that cloud of black smoke, large PM quickly settles to the ground and is not really harmful to human lungs. Overfueling an engine actually causes it to run cooler which actually lowers NOx which is the main gas being complained about here.

        Modern diesels, when working properly and equipped with DOC/SCR/DPF are extremely clean and produce very little greenhouse gases. I have no interest in an EV.

      2. Man, dont worry. Polluting doesnt matter, its not like global warming is real!!! Just ask Trump… bwaaahahaha. ;p

        1. Polluting is one thing, co2 emissions made only by humans which represents less than .5% of the total co2 generated on planet earth is not going to change a thing in the short or long term. volcanoes, oceans, bacteria and natural chemical reactions on earth represent well over 95% of all co2 production on earth. Us burning fuel is totally negligible at Les than 1%. If you want to stop co2 production go cover all the oceans bacteria and all of nature’s reactions. What we do is totally nothing and this is why there has been NO WARMING IN THE LAST 17 YEARS.

          So I have a 2012 RAM 3500 and now over 215000 km and my DPF has never been serviced and I didn’t even do the cleaning on the EGR cooler yet. I am already due to do it a second time now lol so I figure I will do it now. This seems to be a defective scr why doesn’t FCA and Cummins just split the bill and get on with the replacements. Geese guys! Cummins sold over 2 million engines and Ram over 2 million trucks. Bite the bullet and keep on truckin!

      3. Its not just about green. Electric vehicles are better in every way and will bring the consumer something refreshing instead of buying the same crap for 2 decades now. Everything is moving to electric. Every tool, every piece of equipment and machinery and vehicles are converting to electric because of the serious advantages that even without the green factor is a superior choice.

          1. Generator electric is already proven to be more efficient. Its not rpm laden and it has degenerative braking.

            1. And the generator electric is only here to serve one purpose. To give us range until enough infrastructure is in place to move to all electric and if you dont need range than you buy all electric which is an even better choice. Far superior than the current junk we buy.

            2. You guys talk about electric but of all the co2 that is produced by humans on earth electricity production accounts for nearly 75% of that number. So really if you want to reduce CO2 then we should get rid of all electric devices lol think about that one. Your changing your dollar for 4 quarters!

          2. Sorry Daniel, you are wrong.

            Diesel generator with an electric motors for the wheels is th way to go. And it is the way it has already gone.

            1. the only real issue i have for the electric vehicles is the price point. Want to see under $30k with extended cab. Otherwise I am good to go. What a miserable song you got stuck in my head today Rambro. lol

            2. Enjoy the electric dance slide Canoepaddler. LOL. I cant believe I watched the whole 4 minutes. 🕺💃

        1. And job site contractors who use their battery powered tools everyday are consistently replacing battery packs every year also. Tools are going cordless due to convenience of having no cords, not because they are more efficient. Actually, your most powerful tools (rotary hammers, gear reduction drills, etc) still use a cord for the majority of them because they need max power to produce max torque over long periods of use. GM’s battery systems are probably the best in the industry because of their individual cell heating and cooling to keep the battery at consistent temps for longer life and more consistent charging and withdrawal, but they are also heavy due to this technology. Vehicles like the Leaf or the new Hyundai electric coming out are air cooled battery systems, but also suffer from reduced ranges in the temp extremes. Plus they also have faster degradation due to the affects of extreme heat and cold. Having a battery like the Bolt’s or Volt’s in a full size truck that is capable of towing 10,000 lbs for great distances would require a battery the size of the entire box based on the size of the Bolt’s battery and it’s range with the required power it needs to produce.

          For trucks, I’d like to see a more Volt type system where a decent size battery could operate the truck up to 50-75 miles for daily commutes to work and back, to the lumber store, etc, and then a gas engine/generator would power the battery (which still propels the truck) for extended ranges or when towing. The problem is that tow ratings would drop due to the weight of the battery now mounted in the truck.

          We haven’t even discussed the power demand electric vehicles will put on the grid if they became mainstream. Right now there are places in North America with old power systems, or still using coal, etc which are maxed out. Would taxpayers be willing to not only pay a lot more for an electric vehicle but also pay a lot more in taxes to build additional power supply stations, whether it be solar, wind, coal, nuclear, etc?

          1. Dpach you seem to forget when fuel was 4 dollars a gallon. They will take your money either way. I bet raising fuel prices by 1 cent could pay for all the electrical grids required. Its a rip off. And as far as batterry weight and size concerns go maybe take a look at the city busses and heavy machinery that are available in any shape or form right now whether you want a scissor lift or a 200,000-lb scoop tram every single piece of equipment is now available in battery power. They dont build them to keep them they sell them to very well informed businesses across the world who choose to buy them because they are a superior product and they are multiplying quickly. A truck eliminates a large fuel tank, transmission, drive axles and a large motor along with a myriad of other related parts. Look at Workhorse W15. Has a 2200Lb payload capacity with an onboard generator 465HP 0-60 in 5.5 seconds. This is the first, what did the first ICE engine look like. These trucks will only get better and workhorse for years now has been selling to fleets and proven themselves.

            1. Curious on how many W15s are in service and their real world performance. Sure would like to see the under”lying” assumptions on their ROI chart. Can you point to a link, or is this the usual vapourware?

            2. Rambro, you keep mentioning the workhorse, but yet you argue the weight of the battery would be offset by no engine, transmission, etc. The workhorse is an extended range electric truck like the Volt and has a combustion engine used as a generator so very little weight savings there (maybe 1/3 since electric systems require large voltage regulators, controllers and converters which also add weight). If you don’t want transmissions or drive shafts, you need electric motors on each drive wheel or at at least one in the front and one in the rear with drive shafts to the wheels, which balances off no transmission, less driveshafts or differentials. Plus, the workhorse may have a 2200 lbs payload (which is simply due to increased suspension design for fleets), but has a limited 5000 lbs tow rating, and only 80 mile electric range.

              A lot of your electric industrial equipment being used is a requirement due to being either underground, or reduced pollution environment. The city buses like the GM ones all over California are a whole different game since they are very heavy units plus their sheer length allows for large batteries. A truck would have to be 40 feet long ton be 100% electric due to battery size requirement when under load like towing especially by the time the HVAC system is added to keep the battery pack at ideal temps in winter and summer.

          2. Dpach, apparently you haven’t bought construction tools lately. My 4 Makita batteries have been with me since 2009. Daily use but not heavy use. Friends of mine, drywallers, are using their Hilti screw guns almost non stop at times and they still last over two years. Usually the clutch on the gun goes before the batteries. Lithium batteries are awesome compared to the old NiCads.

            You should also check out DeWalt’s newest tools. They allow up to 120 Volts running large tools or 60V for more portable tools. I just spoke to a framer a couple of weeks ago. One 9Ah battery usually lasts him the entire day. The larger tools that use 120V now offer the same amount of power as any standard tool running on a 120V household circuit.

          3. Dpach is right.

            Rambro – I’m curious to hear what size and horsepower range extender you think would be required to maintain 465 electric horsepower

            1. Since when does a truck require full time 465HP. The generator keeps the batteries charged when you need it. Under regular driving when trucks are at 1100 to 2500 rpm they might be using 100HP if that. How long the batteries can sustain full power when needed for big mountains, I do not know? But my bet is they have it figured out. Workhorse already has fleet trucks that haul heavy for years with success so I am sure it works.

            2. Rambro,I have heard closer to 50-60 HP to go down the hwy. Think about the V8 engines with MDS. So you have to wonder how much power are those 4 cylinders producing at part throttle.

            3. I would imagine the generator produces slightly more HP than whats needed at cruise and the batteries handle the peak HP at more when needed under heavy load and get charged on the downhills or under small load conditions. You would have to be climbing a hill or be at full throttle for likely over an hour to completely drain the batteries but I dont know what those specs are. But there isnt a situation I see where its not likely that the batteries will have a transition on the highway where they are being charged more often than not. If it is possible to drain them then make them bigger and put a bigger generator but I am sure Workhorse already did this correctly.

            4. I would agree. To move the vehicle requires a specific amount of HP. If the batteries need recharging then that would consume more power to generate the extra amperage. DPACH mentioned GM vehices have a HVAC system dedicated for the batteries. Ford does the same thing. That will require some power too.

              An electric generator engine can be fine tuned for efficiency. Similar to the Atkinson conversion.

            5. And I read the ICE engine connected to a transmission is a huge double digit power loss from mechanical losses and it burdens the engine to run ineficiently all depending on the load and speed you are at the gearing and transmission are huge losses due to many factors. I agree the generator just has to idle at peak efficiency and thats it, in order to charge batteries. Unlike a generator with no battery power, it too will stress with running at peak rpm and low rpm depending on demand but with the battery charging it just maintains one speed which is the most efficient. So I believe from what I read.

            6. Yes I believe the numbers are 16-20% loss through the transmission. A manual is slightly less. Then there is losses through the rear diff too.

            7. Rambro – It would take an ice generator of around 550 hp to sustain 465 electric horsepower.

              Range extended hybrids work just find for low-load small passenger vehicles that are only demanding 50 hp under most conditions.

              Use some logic, a gas powered truck that can normally pull 15 mpg on the highway empty, often only returns 5-8 mpg while under load towing. Around 65% less efficient when there is a strong demand for engine torque.
              Your 80 mile range electric truck is now going to have a range of under 30 miles if being used to tow.
              Let’s say you want to drag your boat to the lake 6 hours away, what do you do? You’ll get an efficient half-hour of running, then your are going to demand full torque from that range extender. At full demand, you will have efficiency losses of over 30% between driving the generator, processing and converting the electrical energy, and then losses in charging the battery. It would be a laughable effort.

              Battery powered vehicles have an application, and that application is short range fleet use. It will never be a suitable replacement for a multi-purpose utility vehicle (Truck / full-size SUV)

          4. No, and no. 2 problems with your ideas. A truck towing big loads does not need a big battery. You can just have a big engine and a small battery if you want. In fact, you can have a diesel generating electric truck that weights less than a regular diesel truck, because of the weight benefits of no tranny or rear end. and other parts if you want that.

            The other nutty thing you said is that electric vehicles will strain th electric grid. No. In fact, they add to the grid. Most big power companies are strongly backing hybrid electrics, because they can run solely on fuel and add electricity back into the grid by plugging them in during blackouts etc.

            So, and electric truck with a generator combustion engine is the way to go.

            Get it? got it? good. What will it take to get all this through ye’all’s heads?

    6. The CARB (California Air Resources Board) emmission “police” usually do surprise vehicle inspections in conjuction with the Highway Patrol at most of the drag strips, Pomona car show swap meet, etc. They wait until the venue is over and check the vehicles exiting with an infared emission monitor. Its quite a site to see all the 60k+ lifted diesel trucks pulled over and fined for illegal exhaust systems and modified engines. Their owners look suprised and shocked that they got “caught”. This will someday happen in your neighborhood so think again before you modify your engine and throw away that $3000 dollar DPF filter!

      1. Good. I don’t fart in their direction. I expect the same courtesy from them when they think it’s okay to poison our air carelessly.

    7. I’ll be happy as hell with a bone stock midsize with a 4 pot diesel.No programmers etc.That will suit me just fine.I don’t need no steenkin’ hotrod truck ;}>

    8. Awesome video charlotte! Super interesting. If ammonia is the most important part of the reaction, I wonder why/if ammonia dissolved in water would work. Def/urea is rediculously overpriced. I don’t own a diesel, but I bet the cost of def gets annoying real quick for those that do.

      1. And some say heavy trucks don’t drag race. I did it all the time when I drove. I could actually double my revs and without clutching drop gears just right into the hole if you got it just right but its a very small window which gives you near 0 shift times when you don’t have to clutch in a big rig, which gives you more oomff every gear. You gear shift a rig without clutching at lower revs but it still a small window, double the revs and the window is a very small crack but a lot of fun once you get enough practice, saves a lot of footwork as well. Now with electric you just mash the throttle down and that’s it. I still like it, more power the better.

    9. Funny this lawsuit. I doubt seriously that FCA or Cummins will give them a dime.For the majority of Ram 6.7L owners I talked with, it took with a appointment set up all of 1 hour and 30 minutes.Mine took all of that as well because they were running a sale on oil changes for diesel trucks so I had a oil change done as well..The S85 recall instructions call for the removal of the SCR and replaced with a different design interior wall liner.Then the tech removed the ammonia sensor caps the wiring.The ammonia module as well is removed 4 small bolts.Plug-in with Chrysler WiTech and uploaded the revised software. Bingo boy howdy a car wash,vacuum interior on your way.I myself have see no serious fuel mileage loss. And when the lawyers computed the diesel gallons lost per year they quoted 2.50 a gallon. Were I live it is 2.24 a gallon.Towing our 5th Wheel trailer 11,639lbs I have seen no difference in the truck’s ability together out of it’s own way.I bet that one guy in that lawsuit who during his vacation with and brought a new F250 took it on the chin with his trade value with a CEL Light illuminated during a trade in assessment.And knowing this guy is fed up. Wow perfect storm for a sales person. I don’t get it at all. To be honest those SCR units are not cheap around 5000.00 dallors so these guys were notified by mail,and if they have there email set up with Mopar Connect they would have known you just can’t show up at a dealership one day and say I like S85 recall done.most dealership I seen in Texas only have maybe 1-2 Cummins certified Techs.

    10. Now my turn.

      Good video Charlotte!!! Chemistry classes served you well. And congratulations! I will commit one little part of your little lecture on how all that def works. When you said world health organization said an x amount babies died of said component of gas. My little red flag goes up. The world health organization is a left organization and the info they provide has tendency to shape a opinion to there views. I take what they say with trepidation concerning like they said about x number babies dyeing a yr.

      See how government has made DSL more expensive ? It will only get worse. Now you notice Charlotte didn’t tell you how much of nitrogen monxide and deoxide will kill you or the trees or said planet. I’d imagine it such mynute amount that it will not effect you at all. Matter afact getting a sunburn would be more harmful than what comes out of DSL tail pipe then nitrogen. Since I said all this I am not surprised with government looking at ram and the DSL engines.

      Oh you electric vehicle fans out there don’t think you are out of the woods I red not a long ago that they produce gas to. So I’m sure government will be on top of this. Cost will go up to stop this gas to.

      1. Gas was 4 dollars a gallon until electric scared the sht out of these crooks. It will be a battle for sure but as I see it, the consumer is still winning otherwise gas would be 5 dollars a gallon right now. At least with electric we will get new material, like better traction, more ground clearance, peace and quiet on nature tours, no smell, healthier all around, charge your house on blackouts, use power tools or charge them at construction sites, superior acceleration without giving cancer to the guy behind you, better balanced vehicles which means better cornering and better stability, and something new is exciting. buying the same junk for the past 2 decades is really getting old in the tooth.

        1. You are either unbelievably stupid, ignorant, or both. You should stop posting because you keep making yourself look like a fool.

          1. No, clearly we are the fools. We didn’t know that the threat of a few electric cars could slash the value of oil by 2/3rds! Who knew that the vehicle you plug into your house to charge will also charge your house. I’m just not smart enough to figure certain parts out. Let’s see, no power at home… plug truck in to house to power charger to recharge truck… yes I got it now!

      2. Marc ,the young lady explained her self very well..She stated facts ,left or right it don’t matter facts are facts..

      3. Electric vehicles has nothing to do with gas prices. Electric vehicles is just small fraction of total car sales. To think otherwise have not a clue how fuel prices are priced. I cannot believe people to believe in such nonsense. Guys don’t be fake news.

    11. That Toyota semi I posted the video for produces only pure water. And the hydrogen it uses can be produced using green energy electricity.

      It has a range of over 1000 miles.
      Hydrogen can be produced at the refueling point especially useful along interstates for long haul truckers. But Toyota plans to start with these truck at loading terminals.
      It took a lot of money to fine tune the fuel cells. So a bunch of people thought a battery or hybrid systems would be a short cut. But advancement in fuel cell technology has proceeded at a much faster clip than batteries.
      Fuel cell vehicle uses no transmission other than possibly a differential type unit.

      Our electricity infrastructure is crumbling already. It can not handle the increased electric power needed to individual homes required of a change to battery type electric transportation system.

      Actually California transmission lines can’t handle the current production of our solar systems. We actually have paid Arizona to take our excess energy. On a couples of days California has produced over 50% of its needs through green energy.

    12. Charlotte,

      I enjoyed the video. But I don’t accept that urea can be produced with out a ‘spark’.

      Urea requires 450 k and 200 ATM pressure to be produced I believe. To me the energy required to do this constitutes a large ‘spark’. LOL

      Other than in our bathrooms this does not happen in nature. 😮😂

      Am I correct?

      I am not particularly religious although a man of faith.

      My argument is more of one of definition than religion. But I bet in the 1800’s this idea of, ‘sparklessness, created
      quite a uproar. 🎧

      1. The guy who invented the thermometer was almost stoned to death because he had a 30 foot thermometer sticking through his roof that proved an atmosphere existed. Religious folk could not handle this, their brains could not function around this thought so he had to take it down but he was able to use mercury instead and was therefore able to hide his experiments and not be killed for it.

    13. And on another note if we know the sea is rising and we have engines that can run on water and we have too much water than what’s the problem. Kill two environmental disasters with one stone.

      1. There is hydrogen in the water to be burned and then you get pure oxygen. Nothing wrong with pure oxygen.

            1. Gas is nothing compare to hydrogen or oxygen. Diesel is most safe fuel in any car accident , or during a handling.
              Than gasoline, propane, hydrogen..I don’t know where to put batteries, but I don’t want to be near them if in an accident and they are not safer, than diesel fuel.

    14. Honda, Toyota, Hyundai, Mercedes Benz and BMW all have fuel cell vehicles in operation. Honda also has a home use hydrogen generator.

      In addition to the Toyota semi truck, next year the Nickola semi should be ready for lease. They promise 1 million miles of free fuel with each lease. I can’t remember the lease cost but I it seemed to be quite cheap

      1. Thats an awsome link Buddy. This really shows what a waste of time diesel is. No competition, so true. Ford, GM, Ram and Nissan must be really dumb or controlled by fuel lobbyiests. Only Toyota was smart enough to stay away from diesel in the US. But elswhere now will get wind of this and diesel will be ended as stated in your link. Very true. What an awsome looking semi. I hope Kent gets to try it out on TFL on the Gauntlet. LOL. That would be awsome.

        1. Not only does it destroy the diesel the truck is lighter so it can haul more freight and make more money per mile/ per load.

    15. Working Truck was presented Dec, 16, 2016.
      7000 refundable preorders at $1500 already made.

      Refuel stations and truck ready for lease in 2020. Fuel will be sold to non Nicola vehicles. But at about $3.50/gallon.
      The other car companies already pay for their fuel on their leases. So these stations should help with the introduction of more fuel cell vehicles. Price of fuel not a owner consideration.

      I would expect fuel cells to really take off after Nicola opens their stations.

    16. I don’t think this lawsuit will go anywhere really. Not with the EPA at least. If you read it the complaint is that the scr doesn’t last long and needs to be replaced or serviced and the truck goes to limp mode. Both FCA and Cummins know they need to cover this but their internal quarrel is preventing them from actually doing the service. If ram and Cummings are smart, and knowing that this lawsuit can take 10’s of months to go anywhere, they should just do it already and when the time comes everything will have been already repaired and customers happy. ) thats what I say

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